Blog Betty (Thomas Friedman is a Great Man was an online novel): Racists are all around, sadly

Monday, October 28, 2024

Racists are all around, sadly

Isaiah's THE WORLD TODAY JUST NUTS "From Big Nose's Harlem Mansion"

I love Isaiah for doing that comic. Katrina vanden Heuvel is a racist. So it's fitting that she's so physically repugnant. And she needs to be called out because despite being 'left' -- or a least a whore who slept with her professor -- Katty van van is trying to ensure that Kamala Harris loses the election.

We see you, racist, we see you.

Speaking of racists . . .

Dr. Phil was always a jerk and the years have only made him a bigger one. He showed up at the KKK rally held in Madison Square Garden on Sunday. Ben Blanchet (HUFFINGTON POST) explains:

The NAACP called out Phil McGraw, aka TV’s Dr. Phil, after he declared that America was “built on hard work” at Donald Trump’s Madison Square Garden campaign rally on Sunday.

McGraw, who endorsed Trump at the rally after interviewing him under the guise of asking “hard questions” earlier this year, said it’s time to push back against “cancel culture” and intimidation tactics before tying it to launching his Merit Street Media company in April.

“We didn’t choose the name for that by random... this country was built on hard work, added value and talent. Not on equal outcome, not on DEI, this country was built on hard work,” the TV personality told the MSG crowd.

The civil rights organization, in a post on X, wasn’t having McGraw’s telling of America’s origins.

“This country was absolutely built on hard work Dr. Phil…on the backs of Black, Brown, and lmmigrants from all across this WORLD! Many of which who were forced to do so! SLAVERY,” the NAACP wrote.

“Let us know when you’re ready to tell the WHOLE story.”

Political Sis has the perfect response in the video below.

"Iraq snapshot" (THE COMMON ILLS):

Monday, October 28, 2024. Donald Trump's long desire to be Hitler was on full view in Madison Square Garden, real issues are at stake but JD Vance can't stop lying and we've got seven days until the last day of voting in the US presidential election.

85 years later, the spirit of Hitler returned to Madison Garden yesterday.

MAGA? NAZI? They're both four letter words that translate into: HATE.

Donald and Hitler? They both have six letters. Trump and Adolf? They both have five letters.

Anne Applebaum (THE ATLANTIC) wrote earlier this month:

Rhetoric has a history. The words democracy and tyranny were debated in ancient Greece; the phrase separation of powers became important in the 17th and 18th centuries. The word vermin, as a political term, dates from the 1930s and ’40s, when both fascists and communists liked to describe their political enemies as vermin, parasites, and blood infections, as well as insects, weeds, dirt, and animals. The term has been revived and reanimated, in an American presidential campaign, with Donald Trump’s description of his opponents as “radical-left thugs” who “live like vermin.”

This language isn’t merely ugly or repellent: These words belong to a particular tradition. Adolf Hitler used these kinds of terms often. In 1938, he praised his compatriots who had helped “cleanse Germany of all those parasites who drank at the well of the despair of the Fatherland and the People.” In occupied Warsaw, a 1941 poster displayed a drawing of a louse with a caricature of a Jewish face. The slogan: “Jews are lice: they cause typhus.” Germans, by contrast, were clean, pure, healthy, and vermin-free. Hitler once described the Nazi flag as “the victorious sign of freedom and the purity of our blood.”

[. . .]

Until recently, this kind of language was not a normal part of American presidential politics. Even George Wallace’s notorious, racist, neo-Confederate 1963 speech, his inaugural speech as Alabama governor and the prelude to his first presidential campaign, avoided such language. Wallace called for “segregation today, segregation tomorrow, segregation forever.” But he did not speak of his political opponents as “vermin” or talk about them poisoning the nation’s blood. Franklin D. Roosevelt’s Executive Order 9066, which ordered Japanese Americans into internment camps following the outbreak of World War II, spoke of “alien enemies” but not parasites.

In the 2024 campaign, that line has been crossed. Trump blurs the distinction between illegal immigrants and legal immigrants—the latter including his wife, his late ex-wife, the in-laws of his running mate, and many others. He has said of immigrants, “They’re poisoning the blood of our country” and “They’re destroying the blood of our country.” He has claimed that many have “bad genes.” He has also been more explicit: “They’re not humans; they’re animals”; they are “cold-blooded killers.” He refers more broadly to his opponents—American citizens, some of whom are elected officials—as “the enemy from within … sick people, radical-left lunatics.” Not only do they have no rights; they should be “handled by,” he has said, “if necessary, National Guard, or if really necessary, by the military.”

In using this language, Trump knows exactly what he is doing. He understands which era and what kind of politics this language evokes. “I haven’t read Mein Kampf,” he declared, unprovoked, during one rally—an admission that he knows what Hitler’s manifesto contains, whether or not he has actually read it. “If you don’t use certain rhetoric,” he told an interviewer, “if you don’t use certain words, and maybe they’re not very nice words, nothing will happen.”

His talk of mass deportation is equally calculating. When he suggests that he would target both legal and illegal immigrants, or use the military arbitrarily against U.S. citizens, he does so knowing that past dictatorships have used public displays of violence to build popular support. By calling for mass violence, he hints at his admiration for these dictatorships but also demonstrates disdain for the rule of law and prepares his followers to accept the idea that his regime could, like its predecessors, break the law with impunity.

These are not jokes, and Trump is not laughing. Nor are the people around him. Delegates at the Republican National Convention held up prefabricated signs: Mass Deportation Now. Just this week, when Trump was swaying to music at a surreal rally, he did so in front of a huge slogan: Trump Was Right About Everything. This is language borrowed directly from Benito Mussolini, the Italian fascist. Soon after the rally, the scholar Ruth Ben-Ghiat posted a photograph of a building in Mussolini’s Italy displaying his slogan: Mussolini Is Always Right.

Donald Trump, the overweight hate merchant, lumbered into Madison Square Garden yesterday for a hate rally. 'Comedian' Tony Hinchcliffe couldn't jokes so he instead went with racist attacks. Clayton Davis (VARIETY) reports:

When comedian Tony Hinchcliffe took the stage at Madison Square Garden in New York City on Sunday for a MAGA rally in support of Donald Trump‘s presidential campaign, he didn’t just cross a line — he fully erased it. What he called “humor” was a continuous stream of racist insults and dangerous conspiracy theories, from stereotypes about Latinos making multiple babies, to the “great replacement theory,” the ideology behind violent hate crimes committed by white men against communities of color. This isn’t a joke. It’s a weapon, and I’m fucking tired of being the target, and so are the rest of my people.

Growing up as a Puerto Rican and Black American, I was aware early on that I stood out among many of my classmates and neighbors. I’ve learned to take pride in my roots, believing that America was a place where everyone, despite their differences, belonged. But that notion has shifted sharply as I grew older and witnessed the rise of Trump and the MAGA movement, which cast people who look like me as the villains in a story we’d never written. This shift has forced me, and countless other Latinos, to confront a painful reality: in today’s America, we’ve become the scapegoats in a narrative of fear, blamed and vilified to suit a political agenda.

[. . .]

This wasn’t “jokes.” It was hostility veiled as comedy, delivered with the arrogance of someone who doesn’t understand — or care — how these words impact real lives.These words don’t only hurt Latinos; they ripple through every marginalized community. When one group is vilified, it sets a precedent that any group can be targeted. The anti-immigrant sentiment championed by Trump and echoed by his followers delivers the message loud and clear: when people show you who they are, believe them.

Today, it’s Puerto Ricans. Tomorrow, it will be Mexicans again. A few weeks ago, it was Haitians eating dogs and cats. America’s strength, at least the version of America i thought I knew, has always come from the diversity of its people. We are allowing hate disguised as comedy, or hate straight up, to take the reins. I’m begging for us to reject it.

And here’s a stark reminder for you, Tony: Over 4,000 Puerto Ricans died in the aftermath of Hurricane Maria due to the failed response under the Trump administration. That wasn’t a punchline. It was negligence that morphed into a tragedy. Your so-called “comedy” does not absolve you from the harm caused by your message tonight that you normalize and perpetuate. It will be played on loop in every MAGA party (I’m sure you’ll be attending), and we don’t expect you to apologize. You never do.

Here's AOC and Tim Walz responding to the hate speech.

Jill Clovin and Michelle L. Price (AP) note:

But other speakers also made incendiary comments. Trump’s childhood friend David Rem referred to Harris as “the Antichrist” and “the devil.” Businessman Grant Cardone told the crowd that Harris ”and her pimp handlers will destroy our country.”

The marquee event reflected the former president’s tone throughout his third White House campaign. Though he refrained from doing so Sunday, Trump often tears into Harris in offensive and personal terms himself, questioning in recent weeks her mental stability and her intelligence as well as calling her “lazy,” long a racist trope used against Black people.

The attacks -- not jokes -- on Puerto Ricans. Charlotte Phillipp (PEOPLE) notes:

Soon after Hinchcliffe’s comments began to make the rounds online, Puerto Rican musician Bad Bunny endorsed Kamala Harris by posting a video of her plan for Puerto Rico on his Instagram Stories, and then editing the video to cut to Harris saying: "I will never forget what Donald Trump did."

Singer Ricky Martin, who is also Puerto Rican, shared a clip of Hinchcliffe's jokes on his Instagram Stories and wrote in Spanish: "This is what they think of us."

By contrast? All Donald and his suck up sycophants have is hatred. That's why he's left with no names -- like 'comedian Tony -- and has beens. This was his big event and all it made clear was how awful Trump is and how weak his support is. There was Dr Phil whose show ended over a year ago and is now trying to self-publish his bad videos. There was Hulk Hogan who was a minor celebrity in the 80s, Lee Greenwood who last had a hit single in 2001 and, before that, 1991, Russian paid asset Tucker Carlson who can't get on network TV and those were the 'big' names.

On Dr Phil, POLITCALSIS reality checks his entitled, lying ass.

This was how the campaign made their big last impression, with hate and attacks. And you had Donald insulting the country -- a garbage can. That's what America is to him. David McAffe (RAW STORY) notes:

Some of Trump's own supporters may have been fed up with the rhetoric, as well, because many of them were leaving while he was still speaking, according to CNN politics reporter D.J. Judd.

"We’re about an hour into former President Donald Trump’s much-ballyhooed Madison Square Garden remarks— but Trump took the stage about two hours late," Judd reported. "Perhaps mindful of how late it’s getting, supporters have begun streaming for the exits, even though he’s still speaking."

Jake Johnson (COMMON DREAMS) notes:

While the rally featured familiar bloviating from Trump about crowd sizes and other petty obsessions—as well as absurd speakers such as Hulk Hogan and Dr. Phil—historians and other observers were horrified by what they described as the authoritarian ambitions that were front and center and shamelessly expressed Sunday night.

"The point here is that fascism is on full display, openly: no dog whistles, no plausible deniability," said Kathleen Belew, an associate professor of history at Northwestern University whose work has focused on the white supremacist movement in the United States.

"It's a show of power and another attempt to make this look and feel normal," Belew added. "And it will not just magically disappear after the election, regardless of the outcome. In fact, it might be worth thinking through the very likely possibility that this kind of display suggests that this candidate and this movement don't care that much about the outcome."

One journalist called Trump's event "the most overtly fascist mass rally in New York since 1939"—referring to a pro-Nazi rally held that year at Madison Square Garden—and criticized media coverage of the former president's remarks, pointing to a now-changed USA Today headline as a particularly stark example.

House Speaker Mike Johnson's (R-La.) appearance at the rally made clear that Trump and the leadership of the Republican Party are in sync as the GOP pursues full control of Congress on November 5 and lays the groundwork to enact the former president's agenda.

"We gotta get the congressmen elected and we gotta get the senators elected, because we can take the Senate pretty easily, and I think with our little secret we're going to do really well with the House. Right?" Trump said late Sunday, pointing to someone in the audience—possibly Johnson.

"He and I have a secret," Trump added, in remarks carried live by all three major cable news networks. "We'll tell you what it is when the race is over."

Other speakers at the rally included far-right pundit Tucker Carlson, Robert F. Kennedy Jr., and billionaire Elon Musk, who has funneled roughly $118 million into the 2024 campaign in support of Trump.

"I'm not just MAGA," Musk said, pointing to his black hat. "I'm dark, gothic MAGA."

And when he says that, his audience knows what he means even though the media won't tell you. He's not just MAGA. He's a White man born and raised in South Africa during apartheid. He's a White man who ran from his country when apartheid finally began to crumble. He is a flaming racist who benefited from racism and wants to institutionalize it in the United States.

The rally was awful and so offensive -- especially the 'comedian' -- that Meridith McGraw and Lisa Kashinsky (POLITICO) note:

His racist remarks drew swift rebuke from across the political spectrum, including from a pair of prominent congressional Republicans from Florida and New York. GOP Rep. María Elvira Salazar wrote on X that she was “disgusted” by his “racist” rhetoric that “does not reflect GOP values.” Sen. Rick Scott denounced the “joke” as “not funny” and “not true.” And Rep. Anthony D’Esposito (R-N.Y.) said on social media that “the only thing that’s ‘garbage’ was a bad comedy set.”

The election has real consequences. **Real stakes are at play in this election.

The economy? Julia Conley (COMMON DREAMS) points out, "Recipients of the prestigious Nobel Prize for economics said in a letter Thursday that Vice President Kamala Harris, the Democratic presidential nominee, has outlined an economic agenda that would be 'more sustainable and more equitable' than the policies proposed by Republican contender Donald Trump." Jake Johnson (COMMON DREAMS) adds, "As Republican nominee Donald Trump advances proposals that would further enrich the wealthiest Americans and profitable corporations, an analysis published Wednesday found that Vice President Kamala Harris' tax policy agenda would on average hike taxes on the nation's top 1% while cutting them for every other income group."

It's a real issue. But the media's not interested in real issues. And besides, as Van Jones rightly pointed out last week on CNN, the media is administering an exam and "He gets to be lawless but she has to be flawless." Trump can and does say any nutty thing he wants, any racist thing he wants, but Kamala's the one they critique and come down on. Donald Trump states he wants to suspend the Constitution? And we get stuck with CNN's Dana Bash pooh-pahhing Kamala's plan for housing -- a plan that Dana never addresses or even summarizes. As Natasha S. Alford (GRIO) explained, "Van Jones' comments about the double standard between what is expected of Harris and what Trump can get away with connects to a phenomenon known as 'tightrope bias.' Tightrope bias is defined as 'a narrow range of acceptable workplace behavior for women, people of color and other marginalized groups,' which isn't applied to certain men in power."

Even without that very real bias, real issues are hard for the media because real issues require work and there's no one lazier than TV hosts passing themselves off as journalists.

Real issues? Healthcare?

In Clarkston, Georgia, last week, Kamala Harris spoke about healthcare:

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Ours is a fight for the future, and it is a fight for freedom — for freedom, like the fundamental freedom of a woman to make decisions about her own body and not have her government tell her what to do. (Applause.)

And we — we remember how we got here. Donald Trump hand-selected three members of the United States Supreme Court with the intention that they would undo the protections of Roe v. Wade, and they did as he intended. And now, in America, one in three women lives in a state with a Trump abortion ban.

I don’t need to tell the folks here: Except for Virginia, in every state in the South, including Georgia, there is a Trump abortion ban, many with no exceptions even for rape and incest.

And let me tell you, the idea that someone who survives a crime of a violation to their body would be told they don’t have the authority to make a decision about what happens to their body next — that is immoral. It is immoral. It is immoral. (Applause.)

And everybody here knows, one does not have to abandon their faith or deeply held beliefs to agree the government should not be telling her what to do. (Applause.) Not the government. If she chooses, she will talk with her pastor, her priest, her rabbi, her imam, but not the government, not some folks up in a state capitol telling her what to do with her own body.

And notice, Donald Trump still refuses to even acknowledge the pain and the suffering he has caused.

He insists that, quote, “everybody” wanted for Roe v. Wade to be overturned —

AUDIENCE: Booo —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: — which is just a further example of how out of touch the man is. Everybody wanted this? Women are being denied care during miscarriages, some only being treated once they develop sepsis. They didn’t want this.

Couples just trying to grow their family have been cut off in the middle of IVF treatments. They didn’t want this.

Women have died because of these bans, including a young mother of a six-year-old son right here in Georgia. Her family is here with us tonight, and we speak her name: Amber Nicole Thurman. (Applause.)

And you all have heard me say, look, I do believe Donald Trump to be an unserious man, and the consequences of him ever being president again are brutally serious.

These are just some of the consequences of the Trump abortion bans and what he does and what he’s likely to do.

And I pledge to you, when Congress passes a bill to restore reproductive freedom nationwide, as president of the United States, I will proudly sign it into law. (Applause.) Proudly.

If you've missed it, the Gaza Freaks (people who don't really care about the Palestinians) dismiss this issue as "White woman wanting abortions." It's so much more than that and, as is always the case with US healthcare, it's women of color who bear the brunt of ROE V WADE being overturned. And they're the ones being arrested for miscarrying. Those are points the media refuses to recognize -- All Things Media Big and Small -- but they are points that Michelle Obama recognizes.

That's not the only aspect of Kamala's healthcare plan. Nancy J. Altman (COMMON DREAMS) explains another aspect:

Kamala Harris has a plan to expand Medicare to include home care. If Harris is elected president and signs her plan into law, it will be life-changing for millions of seniors and people with disabilities. Importantly, it builds upon President Franklin Roosevelt’s vision for a New Deal for the American people.

Vice President Harris should get enormous praise for her groundbreaking proposal. Long-term care is a looming challenge that’s barely getting discussed. Harris recognizes this challenge and is offering an important solution: Medicare At Home.

Harris’s Medicare At Home plan would expand economic security by creating a new universal benefit, in the grand tradition of President Franklin Roosevelt and his visionary Secretary of Labor, Frances Perkins.

In 1934, President Roosevelt considered adopting a comprehensive cradle-to-grave program of economic security. Ultimately, he decided to start more slowly and incrementally with what became the Social Security Act of 1935, which, among many other achievements, created Social Security and unemployment insurance. He recognized that Social Security was too important to risk failure by beginning too ambitiously.

A decade later, in 1944, having just been elected for the fourth time, FDR built on this legacy by calling for an economic bill of rights in his State of the Union address. This so-called Second Bill of Rights would give every American the right to comprehensive economic security, including a first–rate education; guaranteed employment at a living wage – “enough to provide adequate food and clothing and recreation”; a decent home; “adequate medical care and the opportunity to achieve and enjoy good health”; as well as “adequate protection from the economic fears of old age, sickness, accident, and unemployment.”

He understood, as Vice President Harris does, that people want the right, the ability, and the assistance necessary to age in place, with dignity and independence. In a capitalist system like ours, where working families are dependent on wages, economic security requires insurance against the loss of those wages, which Social Security and Unemployment Insurance provide. That is necessary, but it is not sufficient. Economic security and a decent and dignified life also require getting the care you need, including home care.

Another serious issue is climate. Olivia Rosane (COMMON DREAMS) reports, "Saying that the upcoming U.S. presidential election could be the most important ever for the future of science, a group of 82 Nobel Prize winners in medicine, physics, chemistry, and economics signed an open letter endorsing Vice President Kamala Harris and warning against allowing former President Donald Trump to return to the Oval Office." Also on climate, Jake Johnson (COMMON DREAMS) notes:

A coalition of leading U.S. environmental groups warned Thursday that a third-party vote in next month's election could help usher in climate disaster by improving Republican nominee Donald Trump's chances of victory, a risk they said the planet can't afford as time runs out to avert catastrophic warming.

Voting for Vice President Kamala Harris and her running mate, Minnesota Gov. Tim Walz, in the November 5 election is imperative because they represent "our best chance at making more progress over the next four years," 350 Action, the Center for Biological Diversity Action Fund, Climate Emergency Action, Earthjustice Action, Food and Water Action, Friends of the Earth Action, and other climate groups wrote in an open letter addressed to "potential supporters of Jill Stein or Cornel West."

** The above from the starting "**" to the ending "**" is from Ava and my "Media: The double standard" -- but bolding and doing italics would have made that a real sore experience for the eyes.

While Kamala was making closing arguments of how life can be better for Americans, Donald was attacking the county and the people in it. And his running mate? Miss Sassy JD Vance spent Sunday bombing on TV.

TAPPER: Senator Vance, good to see you. Thank you so much.

SEN. J.D. VANCE (R-OH), VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Thank you.

TAPPER: So, let me ask, you.

Obviously, Trump former Chief of Staff General John Kelly...

VANCE: Sure.

TAPPER: ... was alarmed, he says, by what he heard when Trump said he wanted to use the National Guard or the Pentagon to go after the enemy within, Americans with whom he disagrees, including the Pelosis, Adam Schiff.

And then he gave an interview. He said that Trump -- quote -- "certainly falls into the general definition of fascist," that he is -- quote -- "certainly an authoritarian, admires people who are dictators."

You've called him a disgruntled former employee, but why shouldn't Americans out there listen to somebody who worked closely with Trump, worked with him longer than you've worked with him, retired four-star Marine general, served his country honorably, who is conservative, who says he agrees with Trump on most policies, but is worried about this aspect of Trump?

VANCE: So, I will say two things in response.

So, first of all, a lot of what John Kelly, pretty much all of what John Kelly accuses Donald Trump of saying, there were other people in the room, Mike Pence's former chief of staff, for example, who've explicitly said Donald Trump never said those things, right?

So, one...

TAPPER: Mike Pence, a guy who is not going to support Trump because...

VANCE: Mike Pence -- Mike Pence's former chief of staff said that Donald Trump didn't say those things, right? So that's number one.

Number two, I actually think there's a -- there's an interesting conversation here to have, Jake, which is, why does John Kelly not support Donald Trump? It's about policy. It's not about personality.

TAPPER: No, he says he agrees with Trump on most policy.

VANCE: No.

TAPPER: He agrees with Trump on most policy.

VANCE: The fundamental..

TAPPER: He disagrees with Trump on how Trump views his role and his -- and the fascism and the authoritarianism.

VANCE: I don't -- I don't buy that. Jake. I don't buy that, because if you actually look at John Kelly, at folks like Liz Cheney, the fundamental disagreement they have with Donald Trump is, even though they say that they're conservative, they're conservative in the sense that they want America to get involved in a ton of ridiculous military conflicts.

They want America to police the world and Donald Trump wasn't.

(CROSSTALK)

TAPPER: John Kelly lost a son in Afghanistan. Why are you saying that -- he -- like, I've never heard John Kelly say whether he supports Iran or Afghanistan.

VANCE: His -- and I -- and I honor his son's sacrifice and I honor his family sacrifice. That doesn't mean he is not wrong about policy.

Do people -- do people who have...

TAPPER: But what specifically are you talking about? What has he said that...

VANCE: Is your argument that a person who lost his son in Afghanistan can't be wrong about public policy?

TAPPER: I'm asking you -- no.

VANCE: Then why bring that up? Let's talk about public policy...

TAPPER: Because you were asked...

VANCE: Because I've never criticized his service or his son's service.

TAPPER: I brought it up because you're acting as if he is pro-war, and I've never heard him say whether or not he supported the war in Afghanistan or the war in Iraq. He was a general carrying out orders.

VANCE: Because I know John Kelly's world view. And I know the people who have attacked Donald Trump the most vociferously on foreign policy will say, well, he's a dictator, when what they really mean is, they won't listen.

[09:05:05]

He -- Donald Trump wouldn't listen to the leadership of the military when they wanted him to start ridiculous conflicts. That is a consistent theme.

And I think that there's a big, big thing going on in American politics. It's a very interesting theme in American foreign policy, where a lot of former members of the Pentagon bureaucracy, a lot of old neoconservatives, they have a fundamental difference with Donald Trump on the question of peace and war.

I believe Donald Trump is the candidate of peace. I think the record supports that. But the reason these guys go after him so vociferously, I don't think that it's about his personality, Jake. I think that it's about, they don't like that Donald Trump said no when a lot of them wanted to start a ridiculous war.

TAPPER: Well, you're -- you're ascribing world views, I think, based on gut, I can't really tell where you're coming from on it. There's no evidence...

VANCE: It's based on people that I've talked to in the Trump administration.

(CROSSTALK)

TAPPER: Sure. John Bolton...

(CROSSTALK)

VANCE: . I'm talking about what John Kelly wanted to do, John Bolton, Liz Cheney. These people have a consistent world view.

TAPPER: John Kelly was at the Department of Homeland Security. And then he was chief of staff. He was not weighing in. I don't even know what you're talking about.

But let me ask you something about John Kelly specifically, because you said the other day -- quote -- "I guarantee John Kelly talked to somebody on Kamala Harris's campaign beforehand," before he did this interview.

Now, I've spoken with people in John Kelly's circle and I've spoken with people in the Kamala Harris campaign. They say there's been no communication the entire time. So where did that come from?

VANCE: Oh, I'm highly skeptical of that, Jake. You know the way that these attacks work. You know the way that these people are often vetted by a campaign before something goes out there.

TAPPER: So you made it up?

VANCE: No, I said that the American media and the American Democratic Party apparatus works a certain way. If it comes out that John Kelly never even spoke with a person in the Kamala Harris, then I'm happy...

TAPPER: I'm telling you that.

VANCE: You're telling me that based on secondhand conversations with John Kelly.

And it's interesting. We've now spent Jake three minutes, Jake, talking about John Kelly. If it is true that he never spoke with anyone in Kamala Harris' orbit, I'm happy to apologize to John Kelly for misstating how he delivered this news to "The "Atlantic" magazine.

But let's talk about who -- who did he deliver this news to? To Jeffrey Goldberg, a guy who lied the United States into the Iraq war, which led to the deaths of millions of innocent Arabs and thousands of innocent Americans.

You don't go to that guy if you don't have a particular ideological motive. I think that's what's going on. If I'm wrong, I'm happy to say that I'm wrong.

TAPPER: I think it's interesting that you think that a magazine writer lied the American people into war.

VANCE: Well, he encouraged it. He wrote stories that we're dishonest.

TAPPER: He wrote a story about the gassing of the Kurds in the -- in -- I forget if it was "The Atlantic" or the "New Yorker."

But I'm actually referring to John Kelly talking to "The New York Times."

VANCE: He -- he wrote stories, by the way, where he took what intelligence officials in the American Pentagon bureaucracy said and wrote it as the gospel truth.

And this highlights, the entire point that I'm making about Trump's foreign policy is, this is a guy who wants to use American troops sparingly. He wants peace through strength. It's why his foreign policy was so successful during his first term.

It's all the same people who were wrong about Iraq. They were wrong about the quagmire in Afghanistan. They were wrong about Syria. They were wrong about everything. And now they're coming after Donald Trump, because he actually has a realistic and cautious foreign policy.

TAPPER: I'm talking about people who worked for Donald Trump in his first administration.

VANCE: Sure.

TAPPER: That's what I'm talking about. I'm talking about not just John Kelly, but Mark Milley, who was the Trump-appointed chairman of his Joint -- of the Joint Chiefs of Staff.

VANCE: Who disobeyed Trump's direct orders on troop deployments in Syria.

(CROSSTALK)

TAPPER: I'm talking about the guy that -- that had your job.

VANCE: A massive, a massive, massive violation of his constitutional oath, by the way.

TAPPER: I'm talking about the guy that had your job before Donald Trump's supportive crowd wanted to hang him, Vice President Mike Pence, who said, as you know, that Trump put himself before the Constitution.

I'm talking about General Mattis, also secretary of defense in Trump's administration. I'm talking about Mark Esper, the secretary of defense, who told me that Trump does have fascistic tendencies, John Bolton, H.R. McMaster, Alyssa Farah Griffin.

VANCE: Every single one -- OK, OK, Jake -- are you going to listen to every...

TAPPER: These are Trump administration officials.

VANCE: ... Trump administration official?

Do you know one reason why Kamala Harris doesn't have as many people criticizing her, is because she doesn't fire people who fail. That's why we haven't had a real audit of the disastrous Afghanistan withdrawal is because Kamala Harris protects failures in government. Donald Trump fires them. And I would much rather have the president who fires people who screw up.

Now, Jake, no, no, no, this is an important point.

TAPPER: He did not fire Mike Pence. He did not fire Mike Pence. He did not fire Mark Milley.

It did not go better for him on NBC's MEET THE PRESS.

KRISTEN WELKER:

Let me ask you about some of what we've heard here in the U.S. this week. Donald Trump's longest-serving chief of staff, General John Kelly, said Donald Trump is a fascist. He echoed comments made by the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, General Mark Milley, who also called him a fascist. When two four-star generals who worked so closely with Donald Trump call him a fascist, why shouldn't voters believe them, Senator?

SEN. JD VANCE:

Well, I think that Mark Milley and John Kelly are both disgruntled former employees, and very many of the things that they accuse Donald Trump of, people who were in the room at the time some of those comments were made, they have said explicitly Donald Trump didn't say the things that he was accused of. And, look, Donald Trump was already president for four years. If he was what John Kelly said he was, then why did Donald Trump deliver peace and prosperity? He didn't arrest his political opponents, as Kamala Harris and her Department of Justice have, in fact, done. He didn’t do the accusations –

KRISTEN WELKER:

Hold on, there's no evidence of that. There’s no evidence of that, Senator, that Kamala Harris has arrested their political opponents.

SEN. JD VANCE:

That the Department of Justice has not been going after political opponents?

KRISTEN WELKER:

Senator, there's no evidence of that.

SEN. JD VANCE:

The Department – the current Department of Justice, under the leadership of Kamala Harris and Joe Biden, has absolutely been going after the political opponents of the current Democratic Party. I think that's a disgrace, but it's happening.

KRISTEN WELKER:

There's no evidence that the DOJ is going after their political opponents. Donald Trump was indicted by federal grand juries. Let me ask you, though, you've said that they're disgruntled employees. Trump praised both Kelly and Milley. In fact, he said Kelly was, quote, "One of the best people I've ever worked with." In addition to those two, Trump's national security advisors, two defense secretaries, even his vice president all say he's unfit to be president. Why should the American people hire Donald Trump when the people who worked most closely with him say that he's unfit to serve?

SEN. JD VANCE:

The people who worked most closely with him, most of them are supporting this ticket. You mentioned one person.

KRISTEN WELKER:

But a lot of them aren’t, Senator.

SEN. JD VANCE:

Two people, a disgruntled ex-employee, Kristen, who Donald Trump fired, he said something nice about him and then he fired him, and now that person's attacking Donald Trump. But I think this is important because I think the American media has to be honest. Why is it, Kristen, that John Kelly doesn't like Donald Trump? It's not about personality. It's about policy. And I think the American people have the right to know that Donald Trump rejected the John Kelly, the Mark Milley consensus that America should be the policemen of the world. And because of that, these folks hate him. They – if Donald Trump wanted to start a nuclear war with Russia, I guarantee you that John Kelly and Liz Cheney would be at the front of the line endorsing him. But I think the media misses something really important. This disagreement is not about personalities. This disagreement is because John Kelly didn't like the peace-through-strength policy of Donald Trump. I do, and I think the American people do.

KRISTEN WELKER:

He was his longest-serving chief of staff, and Donald Trump says he only hires the best people. I've got to keep moving, though, because our time is very limited. Former Vice President Mike Pence said, quote, "President Trump asked me to put him over my oath to the Constitution. Anyone who puts himself over the Constitution should never be president of the United States." Will your loyalty, Senator, be to the Constitution or to Donald Trump?

SEN. JD VANCE:

Well, of course, my loyalty is to the American people and to the United States Constitution. But I think the best way –

KRISTEN WELKER:

Over Donald Trump?

SEN. JD VANCE:

The best way to accomplish that loyalty, Kristen, is to get back to a president who delivered the fastest-rising take-home pay in a generation, 1.5% inflation and a secure southern border. I don't think there's inconsistency between loyalty to the Constitution and support for Donald Trump. That's why I'm out there trying to persuade my fellow Americans that Donald Trump's presidency worked for them, and I'd like us to get back to those smart policies.

KRISTEN WELKER:

Just to put a very fine point on this, Mike Pence says Trump asked him to put Trump over the Constitution. If you find yourself in a similar position one day, will your loyalty be to the Constitution or to Donald J. Trump?

SEN. JD VANCE:

I just said my loyalty, Kristen, is to the Constitution of the United States.

KRISTEN WELKER:

Over Donald Trump?

And the segment continues -- stream the video -- but, no, he never answered that. Refused to do so.

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